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Old 02-26-2011, 12:40 AM   #11 (permalink)

 
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absolutely I think BJ would beat Aldo. The FW division is rather weak right now as it hasn't had the exposure which has left it less appealing to small LW's, the most talented FW's have historically fought at LW which is why you are now hearing of UFC LW's wanting to move down to FW now that they are on the big stage.
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Old 02-26-2011, 12:50 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SonOfZion View Post
so you think BJ should be a favorite vs Aldo at FW??

Great question. If he beat Fitch convincingly I think he'd be the favorite. If he loses (and I can't see how he'll win), he'd surely be the underdog.



I just want to remind everyone that although I like BJ, he only ever defended the LW title three times, against:

Sean Sherk (7-4 in UFC, if you count Dunham win)

Diego Sanchez (11-4 in UFC)

Kenny Florian (11-4 in UFC)


And he hasn't won more than three fights in a row since 2004.



But he did smash Matt Hughes when Hughes was absolutely in his prime and seemed unstoppable. Hughes underestimated him admittedly but he still got whomped.



In my opinion if you took the Matt Hughes victories away an argument could be made that Penn is the overrated. But you can't just take victories away, BJ is a natural top talent who has had highs and lows in his career.
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:00 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SonOfZion View Post
lol dont get so upset. I did bet a little $ on Fitch but i would never bet my life savings on a fight, that is ridiculous. I thought it was clear Frankie won the 1st fight and very clear he won the 2nd fight. I think he should be a prohibitive favorite against BJ if he comes back to LW where he belongs after he loses to Fitch.

Why doesnt he go fight Aldo since ppl are so fond of saying he is a FW??? Penn vs Aldo would sell big and then BJ can be 0-5 against champions of 3 divisions, proving he is the GOAT.
Not getting upset at all. Just trying to make sense of what you wrote. Of course Frankie should be the favorite as he has won twice against him albeit I feel the first fight was a draw but you are nuts if you think BJ can't beat Frankie Edgar.

You speak as if these matchups are set in stone and BJ is going to lose 100%. If that is the case, I would be betting my house on something I feel so strongly about.
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:20 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by khoveraki View Post
Great question. If he beat Fitch convincingly I think he'd be the favorite. If he loses (and I can't see how he'll win), he'd surely be the underdog.



I just want to remind everyone that although I like BJ, he only ever defended the LW title three times, against:

Sean Sherk (7-4 in UFC, if you count Dunham win)

Diego Sanchez (11-4 in UFC)

Kenny Florian (11-4 in UFC)


And he hasn't won more than three fights in a row since 2004.



But he did smash Matt Hughes when Hughes was absolutely in his prime and seemed unstoppable. Hughes underestimated him admittedly but he still got whomped.



In my opinion if you took the Matt Hughes victories away an argument could be made that Penn is the overrated. But you can't just take victories away, BJ is a natural top talent who has had highs and lows in his career.
Sean Sherks,losses are to GSP,Hughes,Penn and Edgar

Florians losses are Penn,Sherk,sanchez and Maynard

Sanchez' losses are to Koscheck,Fitch,Penn and Hathaway

GSP's title wins.

Koscheck
13-5
Best wins are Sanchez,Daley and Rumble

Alves
10-4
Best wins are Koscheck and Hughes

Hardy
4-2
Best win is swick

Fitch
13-1
Best win is Sanchez and Alves

Penn
12-6
Best wins are Hughes,Sanchez,Florian and Sherk.

You can try and criticize anyones record.
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:22 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Nothing is 100% in life. I think Fitch wins this fight a very high % of the time, high enough to place a wager.

I think what BJ did to Hughes 7 years ago has as much relevance in the WW division that Hughes himself does at this point in time, just a tiny bit. MMA has changed alot since then and the WW division is now full of guys i think could give BJ a L on any given night.

He could catch Fitch with some power and end it, it would surprise me but its not impossible. He shouldnt even be in the position to get a number 1 contender fight right now is the real point. He is just a name so he got the nod.

If its Lesnar or Randy, ppl boo hoo about it. When its BJ ppl act as if its justified. It isnt.

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Old 02-26-2011, 01:30 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfZion View Post
Nothing is 100% in life. I think Fitch wins this fight a very high % of the time, high enough to place a wager.

I dont think what BJ did to Hughes 7 years ago has as much relevance in the WW division that Hughes himself does at this point in time, just a tiny bit. MMA has changed alot since then and the WW division is now full of guys i think could give BJ a L on any given night.

He could catch Fitch will some power and end it, it would surprise me but its not impossible. He shouldnt even be in the position to get a number 1 contender fight right now is the real point. He is just a name so he got the nod.

If its Lesnar or Randy, ppl boo hoo about it. When its BJ ppl act as if its justified. It isnt.
Getting a title shot because you beat the definitive #2 WW in Jon Fitch >>>>>>>>>>>>> beating heath herring and getting title shots coming off of losses
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:40 AM   #17 (permalink)
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No way is BJ beating Aldo at FW. First off, I don't think BJ could even get to FW w/o gassing out after 2 rounds (max), but I don't think there's anyone at LW that is like Aldo. I'm not saying he's the best p4p or anything, but seriously will hold the FW belt for a looong time regardless of who came down to fight him. At FW, I'd take Aldo over any LW in the world that would cut down. Maybe it's just me, but I think Aldo's a special fighter and I can only imagine his reign at FW going continuing for quite a long time.

Of course, I could be wrong about htis whole thing, beers all night.
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:41 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxic View Post
So much of the BJ hate is not substantiated. First off BJ is a small LW who could fight at FW if he wanted to meaning LW is stepping up a division, he has generally been the smaller guy in most of his LW fights. WW is two weight classes up and while his statistics don't compare you need to put your thinking cap on and realize he has fought 5 times at WW against two opponents who are the two greatest WW's in the history of the UFC if not the entire sport.
And the only guy to really have his number at LW is Frankie Edgar, a guy that is smaller than he is. So how much does this size crap matter?

I never understood this. People say it all the time.

You really think Penn could fight at 145? I mean I guess he COULD. But many fighters could make a lower weight. He isn't a cardio machine, so 145 would be ridiculous for him to make. He would most likely gas at that weight. Penn is an average sized LW. There is a reason why he's going back to 170, a division GSP has a firm grasp on and didn't choose to cut to 145 and try something new with Aldo.
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Old 02-26-2011, 01:43 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Bj Penn = Handy Couture.

I could go into detail but you can probably figure it out.
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Old 02-26-2011, 02:48 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfZion View Post
so you think BJ should be a favorite vs Aldo at FW??
Quote:
Originally Posted by guy incognito View Post
Sean Sherks,losses are to GSP,Hughes,Penn and Edgar

Florians losses are Penn,Sherk,sanchez and Maynard

Sanchez' losses are to Koscheck,Fitch,Penn and Hathaway

GSP's title wins.

Koscheck
13-5
Best wins are Sanchez,Daley and Rumble

Alves
10-4
Best wins are Koscheck and Hughes

Hardy
4-2
Best win is swick

Fitch
13-1
Best win is Sanchez and Alves

Penn
12-6
Best wins are Hughes,Sanchez,Florian and Sherk.

You can try and criticize anyones record.

This is a silly try at a counter-analogy because Kos has beat two of Penn's best wins and GSP stomped him twice, Fitch has beat one of Penn's best wins and GSP stomped him (and Fitch will likely beat Penn), Alves has crushed Penn's biggest win (hughes) and GSP beat him, and GSP has beat Penn twice.



I'm not arguing BJ isn't really good, but he's not Silva/GSP level. His hype is that he's top 3 P4P, and that he defended the LW belt 10 times.


If Florian can make 145lbs Penn certainly could, but he HATES cutting it seems (sort of like Mousasi), and would probably refuse to do it.
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