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Old 05-02-2011, 12:49 AM   #61 (permalink)
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Gotta love slow motion. It makes everyone look like a bad guy. It totally looks like Jake did that on purpose lol.
Not what I was implying just thought it was useful info regarding the discussion

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Stupid much? A broken orbital bone is not as severe as the actual eye, the organ you use to see, being injured. I've had both. At least with the broken orbital, I could still see through the swelling somewhat. When I had my eye ball scratched, I was completely blind on my right side. Bottom line, shut up!!!
Can someone ban this asshat? He's insulting another member in almost every one of his posts.
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Old 05-02-2011, 11:38 AM   #62 (permalink)
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The GSP criticism gets so old. I just wanted to break down his last 10 opponents records. I think the "strength of schedule" metric gets often lost in MMA. I doubt, aside from Edgar, you are going to find anyone who can stack up to GSP as far as strength of schedule goes, so I chose Silva, because he is the one who GSP is most often compared to. I chose the last 10 fights. The last 5 fights doesn't give you quite as much data, but going past 10 and the numbers become a lot less meaningful.

GSP
Matt Hughes 45-8 been finished 8
Josh Koschek 15-5 been finished 2
Matt Hughes 45-8 been finished 8
Matt Serra 11-7 been finished 2
Jon Fitch 23-3-1 been finished 2
BJ Penn 16-7-2 been finished 2
Thiago Alves 18-7 been finished 4
Dan Hardy 23-9-1 been finished 4
Josh Koschek 15-5 been finished 2
Jake Shields 26-5-1 been finished 1

total 253-64-3. opponents have been finished 35 times (4 of those by GSP)

GSP's last 10 opponents have had a 3.77/1 win/loss ratio in their careers and been finished 1 in every 10 fights completely subtracting their fights with GSP from the equation.

Silva
Nate Marquardt 31-10-2 been finished 3
Rich Franklin 28-6-1 been finished 4
Dan Henderson 27-8 been finished 3
James Irvin 15-9-2 been finished 8
Patrick Cote 14-7 been finished 4*
Thales Leites 19-4 been finished 1
Forrest Griffin 18-6 been finished 5
Demian Maia 14-2 been finished 1
Chael Sonnen 25-11-1 been finished 11
Vitor Belfort 19-9 been finished 4

total record 210-72-6. opponents have been finished 44 times (9 of those by Silva)

Silva's last 10 opponents have had a 2.7/1 win/loss ratio in their careers and been finished 1 in every 7.9 fights completely subtracting their fights with Silva from the equation.


The numbers don't lie. GSP's opponents clearly have a better record and are less prone to being finished even ruling out the common opponent. I'm not going to claim that this is the only reason we see more finishes in Silva fights or that Silva isn't generally a much more aggressive finisher. However, I have seen in this thread GSP's words used against him to the effect that he is "unwilling to take risks", which is funny because Anderson Silva is on record having said the exact same thing in regards to the Leites, Cote and Maia fights.

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“I’m no longer a kid, I have much to lose. It took so long to get here and we, as the age comes, do more conservative fights. I won’t expose myself and be knocked out. I have to be the most efficient possible with any opponent that I fight.”
http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2009/04/...ot-unbeatable/
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Old 05-02-2011, 11:48 AM   #63 (permalink)
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Great quote..

I've been saying it for a while, GSP is the champion. He owns the belt, if you want it take it from him. I don't know why people aren't complaining that the contenders didn't finish GSP if he's such a paper champion. He fought Shields for 3 rounds with 1 eye due to a badly scratched cornea and still beat him. The same Shields who went 6 years undefeated in 15 fights.

Strikers can't stay standing with him, wrestlers can't take him down. He neutralizes everyones strengths and beats them because he is well rounded in all areas. So he out strikes ground guys and out wrestles strikers, why is that stupid? Smart fighting if you ask me and if the contenders can't deal with that then they don't deserve the belt. Period.
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Old 05-02-2011, 12:19 PM   #64 (permalink)
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ok ill bring up 2 different ufc champs to show you that gsp doesnt fight for a finish but for a decision.

Frank Edgar- he hit penn and maynard and sherk and griffin etc. with his hardest shots that wobbled them but didnt ko them because he is a natural 145er and he physically cant finish these guys but he is still looking for the finish as best he can. hell he even subbed matt veach to prove he can finish someone on the ground but not standing.

Anderson Silva- he is no.1 p4p and everyone wants a gsp fight with him and people say gsp is the champ and he doesnt need to win by finish because he is dominant and he tries to fight for a finish. no anderson silva has a ufc record 13 fight win streak at middleweight and light-heavyweight and finishes most of them except butt scooters(leites) freak injury steel chins(cote) and people he doesnt give a shite about(maia) and has finished unbreakable people like leben,lutter by sub, henderson by sub, beat a top contender at a higher weight(griffin) and overcame adversary to win(sonnen)

gsp is simply scarred from matt serra and never wants to experience any pain ever again which would be fine if he was not a mixed martial artist.
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Old 05-02-2011, 12:31 PM   #65 (permalink)
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ok ill bring up 2 different ufc champs to show you that gsp doesnt fight for a finish but for a decision.

Frank Edgar- he hit penn and maynard and sherk and griffin etc. with his hardest shots that wobbled them but didnt ko them because he is a natural 145er and he physically cant finish these guys but he is still looking for the finish as best he can. hell he even subbed matt veach to prove he can finish someone on the ground but not standing.

Anderson Silva- he is no.1 p4p and everyone wants a gsp fight with him and people say gsp is the champ and he doesnt need to win by finish because he is dominant and he tries to fight for a finish. no anderson silva has a ufc record 13 fight win streak at middleweight and light-heavyweight and finishes most of them except butt scooters(leites) freak injury steel chins(cote) and people he doesnt give a shite about(maia) and has finished unbreakable people like leben,lutter by sub, henderson by sub, beat a top contender at a higher weight(griffin) and overcame adversary to win(sonnen)

gsp is simply scarred from matt serra and never wants to experience any pain ever again which would be fine if he was not a mixed martial artist.
The same Lutter and Henderson that aren't in the UFC anymore? Forrest "Glass Jaw" Griffin? or Chael "I Was Winning the Fight But Threw it Away Even Though I Was Cheating" Sonnen? Chris "lol srsly slow" Leben?

Lutter got the shot because of Ultimate Fighter, Hendo had just come off a loss to Rampage and he gets a title shot at Anderson. Maia and Vitor are the only two my opinion that really earned the right to contend for the title. The MW division is pretty weak.

GSP fights smart, he's the champion. He's too well rounded for anyone to take and he's beaten all the contenders so far. He deserves to be on top.
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Old 05-02-2011, 12:35 PM   #66 (permalink)
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The same Lutter and Henderson that aren't in the UFC anymore? Forrest "Glass Jaw" Griffin? or Chael "I Was Winning the Fight But Threw it Away Even Though I Was Cheating" Sonnen? Chris "lol srsly slow" Leben?

Lutter got the shot because of Ultimate Fighter, Hendo had just come off a loss to Rampage and he gets a title shot at Anderson. Maia and Vitor are the only two my opinion that really earned the right to contend for the title. The MW division is pretty weak.

GSP fights smart, he's the champion. He's too well rounded for anyone to take and he's beaten all the contenders so far. He deserves to be on top.
*shakes head* lutter was a bjj wizard back then and he got subbed,hendo was pride mw champ and is lhw sf champ now and he has only been subbed by the nig brothers and silva, sonnen is a fantastic wrestler with a steel jaw, leben has a steel jaw, and forrest doesnt have a glass jaw as seen in 90% of his fights. and even if they all sucked(which they dont) he finished all of them. while gsp doesnt finish one eyed kosheck, no stand up jake with bad gameplan, again no stand up fitch, no anything hardy and average ground game alves who has been finished by fitch before.
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Old 05-02-2011, 12:52 PM   #67 (permalink)
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Lutter is 10-6, BJJ wizard? Who exactly did he beat to contend for the title? A bunch of UFC washouts on a Ultimate Fighter episode?

Henderson, SF Champ, lol. Hit the big times now! Couldn't beat either of the UFC champs at the time. Barely could contend with contenders in the MW divison, Franklin beat him if you ask me.

Griffin doesn't have a strong jaw, TKO'd by Jardine, Rashad and KO'd by Silva (walking backwards jab) and Jeremy Horn. Also, pretty sure Shogun is going to either TKO or KO him coming up. Which is sad because I love Griffins heart and personality.

Pretty sure Chris Leben is the slowest guy in the UFC, of course Anderson took him out. Has he ever contended for a title?

Chael is a good wrestler, yes who is 25-11, 15 by decision. Tested positive for testosterone after the fight, great example..

My point is the MW division sucks, the competition is lackluster. The WW division is stacked and GSP gets no easy fights. Other than probably Hardy.. lol. Which he should've finished yes, hopefully he's polished his BJJ.
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Old 05-02-2011, 01:08 PM   #68 (permalink)
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We're still comparing opponents between Silva and GSP let's look at some of the win streaks they had coming in to their respective fights.

Jake Shields 15 fight win streak
Jon Fitch 16 fight win streak
Sean Sherk 12 fight win streak
Thiago Alves 7 fight win streak
Dan Hardy 7 fight win streak
Matt Hughes 6 fight win streak
Josh Koscheck 5 fight win streak
Josh Koscheck 3 fight win streak
BJ Penn 3 fight win streak


Rich Franklin 8 fight win streak
Nate Marquardt 6 fight win streak
Chris Leben 5 fight win streak
Vitor Belfort 5 fight win streak
Patrick Cote 5 fight win streak
Travis Lutter 3 fight win streak
Chael Sonnen 3 fight win streak
James Irving 2 fight win streak
Demian Maia 1 fight win streak
Dan Henderson coming off a loss
Forrest Griffin coming off a loss
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Old 05-02-2011, 01:17 PM   #69 (permalink)
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The same Lutter and Henderson that aren't in the UFC anymore? Forrest "Glass Jaw" Griffin? or Chael "I Was Winning the Fight But Threw it Away Even Though I Was Cheating" Sonnen? Chris "lol srsly slow" Leben?

Lutter got the shot because of Ultimate Fighter, Hendo had just come off a loss to Rampage and he gets a title shot at Anderson. Maia and Vitor are the only two my opinion that really earned the right to contend for the title. The MW division is pretty weak.

GSP fights smart, he's the champion. He's too well rounded for anyone to take and he's beaten all the contenders so far. He deserves to be on top.
Yes he sure does deserve to be on top...but under anderson...ufc is where the best fighters r and the best fights..gsp has lost twice while anderson has not lost at all in the ufc...there could only be 1 p4p fighter...gsp has to prove himself and go up in weight...anderson has already done that...and he did it without grease lol
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Old 05-02-2011, 01:27 PM   #70 (permalink)
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We're still comparing opponents between Silva and GSP let's look at some of the win streaks they had coming in to their respective fights.

Jake Shields 15 fight win streak
Jon Fitch 16 fight win streak
Sean Sherk 12 fight win streak
Thiago Alves 7 fight win streak
Dan Hardy 7 fight win streak
Matt Hughes 6 fight win streak
Josh Koscheck 5 fight win streak
Josh Koscheck 3 fight win streak
BJ Penn 3 fight win streak


Rich Franklin 8 fight win streak
Nate Marquardt 6 fight win streak
Chris Leben 5 fight win streak
Vitor Belfort 5 fight win streak
Patrick Cote 5 fight win streak
Travis Lutter 3 fight win streak
Chael Sonnen 3 fight win streak
James Irving 2 fight win streak
Demian Maia 1 fight win streak
Dan Henderson coming off a loss
Forrest Griffin coming off a loss
As an addendum to this, 4 of Silva's last 12 opponents have been inferior enough that they were cut from the UFC. Of GSP's last 12, NONE have been cut and Hardy is the only one even in danger of it currently. Most of them are still winning enough that they may get rematches.

GSP has fought far tougher competition than Silva (and obviously guys much harder to finish).
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