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Old 11-21-2012, 07:56 PM   #1 (permalink)
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do cornermen impede fighters ?

one thing ive noticed about TUF is fights to get into the house are when fighters are at their peak.

the rest of the fights can be lackluster and boring in comparison.

sometimes, i get irritated listening to the cornerman and wonder how fighters stand the distraction without getting irritated. it seems like a cornermen yelling at someone to throw the outside leg kick is kind of a dumb move.

its not only distracting the fighter & possibly slowing his response time, its also telling the other fighter exactly what they are going to do in advance.

i was wondering if control freak cornermen could be the cause for boring TUF fights and fighters performing below their peak.

and what ppl think about cornermen who approach things as if it were a video game, where they try to tell their fighter to throw a specific punch or kick in real time.

when manny pacquiao or mike tyson fight, i dont know that their trainers micro manage or try to control their fighters are they're fighting.

it just seems kind of dumb to me when mma trainers try to yell instructions every second of every round. it seems like a backseat driver effect. if a racecar driver had someone in the backseat yelling advice I would think it would cause them to drive slower instead of faster..

and i really wonder how much of a negative effect it could have and whether or not it could actually cause some fighters to perform lower than their peak..
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Old 11-23-2012, 04:33 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trix View Post
one thing ive noticed about TUF is fights to get into the house are when fighters are at their peak.

the rest of the fights can be lackluster and boring in comparison.

sometimes, i get irritated listening to the cornerman and wonder how fighters stand the distraction without getting irritated. it seems like a cornermen yelling at someone to throw the outside leg kick is kind of a dumb move.

its not only distracting the fighter & possibly slowing his response time, its also telling the other fighter exactly what they are going to do in advance.

i was wondering if control freak cornermen could be the cause for boring TUF fights and fighters performing below their peak.

and what ppl think about cornermen who approach things as if it were a video game, where they try to tell their fighter to throw a specific punch or kick in real time.

when manny pacquiao or mike tyson fight, i dont know that their trainers micro manage or try to control their fighters are they're fighting.

it just seems kind of dumb to me when mma trainers try to yell instructions every second of every round. it seems like a backseat driver effect. if a racecar driver had someone in the backseat yelling advice I would think it would cause them to drive slower instead of faster..

and i really wonder how much of a negative effect it could have and whether or not it could actually cause some fighters to perform lower than their peak..
It probably does on TUF because they are in a small gym with a handful of people but at an actual event, you can't even really hear anyone most of the time.
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Old 11-23-2012, 06:56 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Trix, you make a good point. Its something I've thought about before. Surely it must be quite simple to give certain moves and strikes codes? They manage it on the PPVs etc so why not Ultimate Fighter? I would find it incredibly annoying. Is this happening with every fighter then? Reason I ask is, in Forrest Griffins first book, he explains that fighters should tell their trainers on how to instruct them during a fight. Now if Forrest does that, I'd say most people do so why not the Ultimate Fighter contestents? If the UF contestents do tell their trainers on how they'd like to be intructed, why are they asking their trainers to call out the actual move?

Unless of course they are asking their trainers/coaches to call the wrong moves intentionally to confuse their opponents and opposite coaches.
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Old 11-23-2012, 07:06 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tyson Fury View Post
Trix, you make a good point. Its something I've thought about before. Surely it must be quite simple to give certain moves and strikes codes? They manage it on the PPVs etc so why not Ultimate Fighter? I would find it incredibly annoying. Is this happening with every fighter then? Reason I ask is, in Forrest Griffins first book, he explains that fighters should tell their trainers on how to instruct them during a fight. Now if Forrest does that, I'd say most people do so why not the Ultimate Fighter contestents? If the UF contestents do tell their trainers on how they'd like to be intructed, why are they asking their trainers to call out the actual move?

Unless of course they are asking their trainers/coaches to call the wrong moves intentionally to confuse their opponents and opposite coaches.
That sounds reasonable enough but if the coaches are yelling out the wrong stuff then the fighter knows what NOT to do but may not be sure what to do especially if they are losing the fight. I imagine it mostly has to do with the fact that a fighter on TUF hasn't fought around these people and isn't around them much. I mean the entire time they are on the show is about the prep length for a fight for a normal UFC fighter (8 weeks give or take). I'm sure the coaches may not know alot about what the fighter is capable of going into the fight until they've fought and advanced once or twice whereas someone who is already in the UFC has been fighting and works with the same people each fight for the most part.
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Old 11-23-2012, 07:46 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trix View Post
one thing ive noticed about TUF is fights to get into the house are when fighters are at their peak.

the rest of the fights can be lackluster and boring in comparison.

sometimes, i get irritated listening to the cornerman and wonder how fighters stand the distraction without getting irritated. it seems like a cornermen yelling at someone to throw the outside leg kick is kind of a dumb move.

its not only distracting the fighter & possibly slowing his response time, its also telling the other fighter exactly what they are going to do in advance.

i was wondering if control freak cornermen could be the cause for boring TUF fights and fighters performing below their peak.

and what ppl think about cornermen who approach things as if it were a video game, where they try to tell their fighter to throw a specific punch or kick in real time.

when manny pacquiao or mike tyson fight, i dont know that their trainers micro manage or try to control their fighters are they're fighting.

it just seems kind of dumb to me when mma trainers try to yell instructions every second of every round. it seems like a backseat driver effect. if a racecar driver had someone in the backseat yelling advice I would think it would cause them to drive slower instead of faster..

and i really wonder how much of a negative effect it could have and whether or not it could actually cause some fighters to perform lower than their peak..
There is a lot wrong with this imho. Fights on tuf suck because the guys don't want to take injuries they are out of their comfort zone and they already figure they've got a shot in the ufc. If Dana gives a single contract only to the winner this year things will be different. Not to mention mostnof the guys carbon there for personality not talent.

Second all coaches are yelling at all times even during the big fights. When you are there live you hear them. You don't hear it on the tv broadcast because they fade it out in the truck. It does however depends on the fighter. Some guys want step by step instruction and want to be given commands like a video game others just want general direction or whatever it depends on the fighter. But no coach is just dead quiet the whole time. You best believe Manny and Tyson were getting yelled at. I've watched Manny spar in person his corner is never quiet.

Oh and I don't know a ton about Nascar but I know for a fact they have a guy in their ear the entire four hundred lap race. Why do you think fighters change gyms and suddenly step up a whole level it's not just the training partners fighters have teams too.

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Old 11-23-2012, 10:49 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I think the one and only reason for bad fights on TUF is that the fighters just aren't that good. Plus they get put through these meaningless cardio excercises that will only drain their energy. They're in that house for what? 6 weeks? So what good are cardio excercises? The coaches should start teaching these guys basic things like how to defend a takedown, how to get off the cage, yet every season I see coaches trying to teach these guys new stuff they won't be able to use in the short term anyway. How can this not be confusing for a guy who has four pro fights?

edit: no idea where that quote came from
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Old 11-23-2012, 03:00 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Life B Ez View Post
There is a lot wrong with this imho. Fights on tuf suck because the guys don't want to take injuries they are out of their comfort zone and they already figure they've got a shot in the ufc. If Dana gives a single contract only to the winner this year things will be different. Not to mention mostnof the guys carbon there for personality not talent.

Second all coaches are yelling at all times even during the big fights. When you are there live you hear them. You don't hear it on the tv broadcast because they fade it out in the truck. It does however depends on the fighter. Some guys want step by step instruction and want to be given commands like a video game others just want general direction or whatever it depends on the fighter. But no coach is just dead quiet the whole time. You best believe Manny and Tyson were getting yelled at. I've watched Manny spar in person his corner is never quiet.

Oh and I don't know a ton about Nascar but I know for a fact they have a guy in their ear the entire four hundred lap race. Why do you think fighters change gyms and suddenly step up a whole level it's not just the training partners fighters have teams too.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3
I don't think I explained what I wanted to say very well.

What I mean to say is, when fighters don't have cornerman during the fights to get into the house on TUF. It seems as if they fight better at a higher level than they do with the latter fights where they have cornermen constantly yelling instructions.

A fighter in a cage trying to split his attention between his opponent and his corner might be compared to driving while talking on your cell fone, or driving while texting?

It might be better to focus on one thing than try to multi-task?

In TUF fights that are boring or seem as if fighters are freezing up. It could be a result of sensory / information overload. Trying to keep track of what an opponent is doing and what your corner is saying could be asking a lot. In some cases, a person will tune out the sounds around them and won't hear anything.

Maybe a corner offering instructions can be useful, but it could be a thing someone would need to train to get used to. If its a thing that results in sensory overload it may be that it'll cause a person to freeze and not respond as well as they could.

If driving while texting or talking on your cell fone is bad and causes accidents, I don't really know that fighting while talking to your corner is a great idea.

In some instances it could be really good to have a corner offering advice. Like say in the Okami vs Boetsch fight where Okami was rocked and it seemed like he didn't know wht to do in that situation. If his corner told Okami to tie Boetsch up or try to take him down to give himself time to recover, that might have been invaluable.

But in the case of Silvas fight with Bonnar. Silva's corner was yelling instructions at him and Silva pretty much just ignored everything they said. Maybe if they weren't saying anything useful they were just being a distraction to Silva and in a sense hindering him?

Its just something I've been thinking about...

Thanks for feedback.

Last edited by Trix : 11-23-2012 at 03:02 PM.
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