Mixed Martial Arts Forum banner
1 - 20 of 46 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
80 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here's a decent interview with Kalib Starnes. For Canadian posters, I got the article from canoe.ca (i.e. the online Sun papers). It's got a miniscule fighting subsection in the sports pages - but every now and then there's something good there.
article link

Starnes' comments about his TUF3 experience solidified my opinion that Ken Shamrock is a woefully bad coach. If you recall how Starnes mentioned his rib was FUBARed in his fight with Groves, you might also remember Shamrock saying that Starnes wasn't really hurt (because he knew what broken ribs looked like). Turns out Kalib was in worse shape than he let on.

I liked Starnes - it's too bad he lost recently in his UFC undercard fight. Hopefully, he can come back.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts

Thank you so much for the link to the article. I heard Kalib was hurt badly but man that poor guy - he's a fighter for sure to deal will all that and keep fighting.
As for Shamrock - truly he was a very poor coach on the show - it was often hard to watch and I felt really bad for all the guys on his team as he just wasn't there for them. But on a positive note - I believe after he watched the footage he saw how poorly he behaved and seems to have humbled himself somewhat.

I wish Kalib all the best - go Canadians!
 

·
Hammer Fist Elbow
Joined
·
350 Posts
Hmm OH YEAH! I remember that fight when Shamrock was like "I know you rib is hurt but you got to keep fighting". He probably made him hurt himself more. That ass.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
aznmaniac0909 said:
i dunno if it was more he was a bad coach or the fact he really didnt give a shit
Very true - he was a bad coach because he didn't give a shit. He was very focused on his own goals. I would have to blame Dana for that - he should know these guys enough to know if they could put aside their own agenda to be a benefit to the fighters. Tito did a great job as a coach - he earned my respect from that show 100%.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
80 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
aznmaniac0909 said:
i dunno if it was more he was a bad coach or the fact he really didnt give a shit
I'd say there's a big intersection on the Venn diagram. It's hard to be a good coach if you don't care about your fighters or the job you're doing.

Either way, his fighters didn't benefit from the exchange.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,615 Posts
Kalib was one of my favorites to win the show, and I truly believe he'd be the Middleweight winner of TUF3, had he been on Team Punishment. You could tell the lack of intense training on Team Shamrock really hurt their guys (see Hutcherson gassing against Rory and being knocked out with a ridiculously terrible kick).

By the way, BadHabitBabe, Vancouver isn't too far out of my way if you know what I mean.

Giggity giggity goooo!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
TheJame said:
By the way, BadHabitBabe, Vancouver isn't too far out of my way if you know what I mean.

Giggity giggity goooo!
Oh ya? Is that an invite? LOL
 

·
I eat babies
Joined
·
7,647 Posts
I wonder why they gave Kalib such a tough opponent when he didn't even make the finals. His opponent, Okami, is much more advanced than Kendal Grove's first opponent. Wonder how that works. Anyway, no shame in losing to a better fighter, which I think we all knew Okami was before the fight even started.

I get the feeling Ken's behavior was scripted. I think Dana wanted Tito to be the one with all of the appeal on the show. He knew Shamrock was getting close to the end of his career, and Tito is just getting more and more popular and is still young and has a bright future selling PPV tickets for Dana. I think 1.) Ken was told to take it easy for ratings 2.) The editors of the show made it even worse. Ken is a good coach, and he loves coaching, hence the reason he is now coaching for the IFL, and hence the reason he has had The Lion's Den for so long. Dana is trying to fool newer fans into thinking Tito>Ken because Tito is the future and Ken is the past. Some of the comments we see people make on any of the TUF shows are so taken out of context it's not even funny. I've seen guys commenting on the result of a fight, but you can tell they are making the comment days or weeks before the fight even happens, just cuz you might recognize a scratch on their face or something. I wouldn't read to deep into Ken's 'bad' coaching skills, I really think it was all a facade. The UFC is notorious for taking shit outta context. (THIS MAN IS NOT HUMAN!)
 

·
attention whore
Joined
·
14,445 Posts
Ken was hilarious during the whole "You quit, Kalib!" segment. Did Ken forget about his fight with Fujita?

Starnes is pretty decent. He would've been in the UFC regardless. Losing to Okami isn't shameful.
 

·
I eat babies
Joined
·
7,647 Posts
Damone said:
Ken was hilarious during the whole "You quit, Kalib!" segment. Did Ken forget about his fight with Fujita?

Starnes is pretty decent. He would've been in the UFC regardless. Losing to Okami isn't shameful.
LOL I see your point but I gotta say man, Ken thought he was having a heart attack in that fight against Fujita. We all know Ken's not a real quitter, he's had some battles in his day. If he thought he was having a heart attack, then that's understandable. Rumors were that he had been having troubles with his heart for some time before the fight and then he felt his heart beating irregularly and got worried. He obviously just doesn't wanna die in the ring haha. Fujita wasn't even beating him up nearly as bad as Ken is used to, so I knew something was up.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Goin' down in the ring.

WouldLuv2FightU said:
He obviously just doesn't wanna die in the ring haha.
But if you were a legend wouldn't the Octagon be a great place to die if it was your time?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
457 Posts
I didn't know about his leg. That's rough, knowing you have that many intense weeks ahead of you and in order to protect yourself you've almost got to keep it a secret, possibly even from the UFC doctors.

The way he crushed Stine at the beginning of the show made me think he could be a finalist. Too bad how it worked out. Hopefully his contract gets him another fight or two in the UFC, and hopefully they aren't dark matches. I get the feeling a lot of people want to see him fight again.


I liked Kalib when he was on the show but I don't respect his behaviour during the fight with Grove.

He knew right away his rib was injured but he had too much pride/too little experience to quit. Instead he turned and told the ref he was hurt, and the ref looked back at him like "well what do you expect me to do about it?" Then he tried to get his corner to quit for him, complaining to Ken, who Kalib already knew was a blockhead. I think in both cases he knew they wouldn't stop the fight but he tried anyways so he could have somebody to blame afterwards.

He should've sucked it up and made a verbal tap-out like Jeremy Horn did against Chuck Liddell. There is no shame in quitting if you're injured. Trying to slip out of it without hurting his ego made me think less of him, but then again I've never been in that kind of a situation so what do I know?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
80 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
WouldLuv2FightU said:
I get the feeling Ken's behavior was scripted. I think Dana wanted Tito to be the one with all of the appeal on the show. He knew Shamrock was getting close to the end of his career, and Tito is just getting more and more popular and is still young and has a bright future selling PPV tickets for Dana. I think 1.) Ken was told to take it easy for ratings 2.) The editors of the show made it even worse. Ken is a good coach, and he loves coaching, hence the reason he is now coaching for the IFL, and hence the reason he has had The Lion's Den for so long. Dana is trying to fool newer fans into thinking Tito>Ken because Tito is the future and Ken is the past. Some of the comments we see people make on any of the TUF shows are so taken out of context it's not even funny. I've seen guys commenting on the result of a fight, but you can tell they are making the comment days or weeks before the fight even happens, just cuz you might recognize a scratch on their face or something. I wouldn't read to deep into Ken's 'bad' coaching skills, I really think it was all a facade. The UFC is notorious for taking shit outta context. (THIS MAN IS NOT HUMAN!)
Do you seriously believe that the UFC and Dana White are so bereft of morals that they'd toss the careers of 8 fighters under the bus to improve Tito Ortiz' rep? Waitaminute, don't answer that. What's the opposite of a nuthugger? There seem to be a few people here who can find a nefarious plot in any situation. DANA WHITE GAVE THE FIGHTERS STAPH INFECTIONS ON TUF4 BECAUSE XYIENCE IS GETTING INTO ANTIBIOTICS!

Think Occam's Razor: the simplest explanation is almost always the right one. In this case, Ken did a brutal job of coaching.

I'm not really familiar with Ken's coaching achievements, although I've heard of the Lion's Den (I'm new, so sue me). Has the Lion's Den produced any fighters worth mentioning recently? Everyone seems to be part of the Miletich camp or Team Punishment or Team Quest or Chute Box or wherever. I haven't heard of anyone from the Lion's Den. (I'm not being crappy here, I honestly haven't heard of anyone fighting out of the Lion's Den.)

I certainly agree that the TUF show used some editing magic and that some bits were scripted, but when it comes to the actual fighting, I still say Shamrock got out-coached.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BadHabitBabe

·
Registered
Joined
·
80 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
speedythief said:
II liked Kalib when he was on the show but I don't respect his behaviour during the fight with Grove.
...
He should've sucked it up and made a verbal tap-out like Jeremy Horn did against Chuck Liddell.
Wasn't that exactly what he did? :dunno:
 

·
attention whore
Joined
·
14,445 Posts
The Den just sort of disbanded over the years. People like Lutter supported it, but trained at several other different camps.

About the Den, Guy Mezger, Frank Shamrock, Pete Williams, Vernon White, & Tra Telligman all came out at around the same time. That's a great group of fighters. Ken's an excellent coach when he's serious about it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
132 Posts
Quietus said:
Do you seriously believe that the UFC and Dana White are so bereft of morals that they'd toss the careers of 8 fighters under the bus to improve Tito Ortiz' rep?

I certainly agree that the TUF show used some editing magic and that some bits were scripted, but when it comes to the actual fighting, I still say Shamrock got out-coached.
I couldn't have said it better my friend - I completely agree - well written post! :thumbsup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
542 Posts
Quietus said:
Here's a decent interview with Kalib Starnes. For Canadian posters, I got the article from canoe.ca (i.e. the online Sun papers). It's got a miniscule fighting subsection in the sports pages - but every now and then there's something good there.
article link

Starnes' comments about his TUF3 experience solidified my opinion that Ken Shamrock is a woefully bad coach. If you recall how Starnes mentioned his rib was FUBARed in his fight with Groves, you might also remember Shamrock saying that Starnes wasn't really hurt (because he knew what broken ribs looked like). Turns out Kalib was in worse shape than he let on.

I liked Starnes - it's too bad he lost recently in his UFC undercard fight. Hopefully, he can come back.
Yeah, with all of the talk surrounding Ken's retirement, people seemed to have softened up 'cause he gave a great speech at the end of his last fight with Tito and he was being called a classy guy. Truth is, Ken is an idiot, cared little about his team or his students and was completely out to lunch in assessing his abilities compared to Tito. I admire his courage and the length of time in the sport but truthfully the guy is a weirdo
 
1 - 20 of 46 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top