Mixed Martial Arts Forum banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Many MMA fighters say: "everyone who cuts weight and steps into the cage to compete, deserves the utmost respect."

Then these same MMA fighters openly treat each other like garbage in interviews and on social media. No respect whatsoever.

Something is wrong with people.

Where did we go wrong?
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
Yeah we at one point were getting away from Ken Shamrock kicking a chair and being all up in arms about stuff. I think the problem is fighters see what Conor McGregor and saw it as a way to get better pay days. They try to get followings using such marketing essentially.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Its not the words or rivalry. Its how some seem hateful and bitter. You could watch clips on youtube of people digging through trash for food and you wouldn't see the type of hate, resentment or bitterness. That you see from some in MMA. Spiritually, hate could be bad for people. Which is why some encourage it.

I didn't mind Tito's beef with Ken Shamrock. The way Tito treated Ken Shamrock. That's how I thought Tito was going to be treated when he got older and younger guys coming up were beating him. I thought Tito was setting the bar for his own retirement there.

Its bizarre to me how ppl don't understand Conor's success. Conor walked into the UFC like he was the baddest mofo on the planet. Then he did a good job of backing it up. Its not what he says that makes a difference. It has more to do with Conor always trying to finish fights. Not playing it safe. Making it look easy when he wins more than 95% of his fights by KO/TKO against top competition. Having the confidence and belief in himself to say things that sound crazy. Then go out there and do them. There aren't many who have that swagger.

If people wanted ugly drama they could watch jerry springer and maury re-runs. That's not what sells. IMO anyways.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
You have to remember that part of Conor's success had to do with psychological warfare against his opponents before the match even started. The problem is that fighters saw what Conor did and didn't fully understand how he was able to execute it. Conor did things in a specific way but in the end it was all business, others really make it personal.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
As far as I know. Conor is great for 2 reasons.

#1 He's willing to lock himself in a gym 8-12+ hours a day. 5-7 days a week. Working and perfecting his craft.

#2 He's willing to study, research and break down the finer points of the game on his own. In a sport where most aren't willing to go that far. Most expect their coaches and support to have all the answers, to shield them from having to think about or learn anything on their own.

Conor's talking and confidence are mere offshoots of him truly believing there's nobody that works harder than he does. Nobody that is willing to go as far as he is, in terms of being a student of the game. The talking isn't the source of his power, its only a symptom of his work ethic, what a gritty competitor he is, and how badly he wants to win.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Greats in boxing like Sugar Ray Leonard and Floyd Mayweather Jr. probably never touched drugs. That's a huge part of what made them greats. Its also a big part of their career longevity and why they can continue to be competitive fighting into their 40s.

MMA today is the complete opposite. Anyone who steps into the cage and fights far below their level. Its very very common for declines to be substance abuse related.

A lot of the time, you can look up someone's record on sherdog. When you see a losing streak. That's when they started doing drugs. When they started winning again. That's when they got clean and sober.

Its just the way things work.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
That's certainly true. But sometimes some fighters took too much of a beating during their drug time and as a result they are too far gone. Ken Shamrock took too much of a beating while on drugs and as a result was simply a shell of what he used to be. Then look at Paulo Filho was high on recreational drugs and never really recovered either.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,528 Posts
Many MMA fighters say: "everyone who cuts weight and steps into the cage to compete, deserves the utmost respect."

Then these same MMA fighters openly treat each other like garbage in interviews and on social media. No respect whatsoever.

Something is wrong with people.

Where did we go wrong?
Two words. It works.

Psych is factor in competition. Controlling emotions and adrenaline are crucial, and much harder if someone knows what buttons to push before the match. With a contentious buildup, you can foster adrenaline dumps and bad decisions.


 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Two words. It works.

People like Muhammad Ali and Conor talk because they take pride in their work and truly believe they're great at what they do. They act that way because its how they've always acted since they were kids.

Its not a shortcut or easy street to success. The way many mistakenly believe it is. That's the weak minded way of looking @ things. Where people delude themselves into believing there's a "21 easy steps to be like Conor McGregor for dummies" book that they can follow.

The fact that people think they can dumb down greatness and hard work to "Conor has no real skill or talent he just talks" only shows how far we've fallen.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
Well to be fair Conor did have enough skill to defeat some of the greatest fighters in the sport, he just didn't have enough skills to stay at the top. Also Muhammad Ali and Conor basically developed a way to get into their opponents head. The problem is that other fighters haven't figured out how to do that correctly.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Conor had cardio issues in the Floyd Mayweather and 1st/2nd Nate Diaz fights. At the press conference for Khabib, Conor ranted like a drunk who might be on something. That could have cost him. Its never been a lack of skill for Conor, its always been cardio and other things that held him back.

I think people are far from recognizing where Conor or Muhammad Ali were coming from. If you think they care about getting inside anyone's head, you're not getting it @ all.

Conor didn't try to get inside Cowboy Cerrone's head. He didn't have to get in anyone's head to beat them and IMO couldn't care less about that. He went into every fight and said "I'm the best and I'm gonna beat you". People act like that's some high level of psychological warfare, which is nuts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Many MMA fighters say: "everyone who cuts weight and steps into the cage to compete, deserves the utmost respect."

Then these same MMA fighters openly treat each other like garbage in interviews and on social media. No respect whatsoever.

Something is wrong with people.

Where did we go wrong?
Sawasdee krab ... from a Thailand point of view or even an Asia Martial Arts point of view ... Muay Thai fights and most Martial Arts ALL have a history of National pride and development and/or King Royal honor and/or Religious training. The fights purpose was to develop the person's Spirit-Soul-Body, to make them a better person for the service of their King-Nation-Country-Religion-Community. Spiritual Religious fight trainers (Bruce Lee) used physical disciplines/fighting to develop ones Spirit-Soul. I was on a quest to understand why my National Thailand Muay Thai teachers did not want or like MMA ?? Their simple answer was there is NO religion behind it, there is no Royal honor and National pride behind it ... they just fight like animals. Now, that is one reason I fell in love with Thailand Buddhist Temple training and fights. These fighters try to be more humble than their opponents, more honorable and more respectful than their opponents. My last fight in Thailand was at the age of 49 years young [I lost the fight]. But for the first time in my life I tried and did fight like they were teaching me. I was humble, soft, lady like Thai silk and had no macho or bad thoughts towards my opponent but my goal was still to KO him out !! In that mode of fighting, I had more endurance, I was soft and like Tai-Chi so the heavy strikes were not damaging to me and I went a full 5 rounds of Muay Thai with full bone on bone leg kicks !! Just some things I learned and may you all enjoy them. ;-) Phra JAO uay phra pon MAK krab, Khru Doc. ;-)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,528 Posts
People like Muhammad Ali and Conor talk because they take pride in their work and truly believe they're great at what they do. They act that way because its how they've always acted since they were kids.

Its not a shortcut or easy street to success. The way many mistakenly believe it is. That's the weak minded way of looking @ things. Where people delude themselves into believing there's a "21 easy steps to be like Conor McGregor for dummies" book that they can follow.

The fact that people think they can dumb down greatness and hard work to "Conor has no real skill or talent he just talks" only shows how far we've fallen.
In short you're saying the mental aspect doesn't work. You're wrong. Ali wasn't calling Liston ugly because he took pride in his work. Conor didn't torture Aldo at press conferences because he believed in himself. They were draining and demoralizing their opponents. Conor went into overdrive trying to do this to Mayweather, but the talent gap was too large to overcome (which is understandable).

Look at Liston at that weigh-in. The man was demoralized and drained. It didn't take all the fight out of him, but it took some, and made Ali's work easier.

You can argue it shouldn't be like this, and only weak fighters succumb, and it's not sportsmanlike, etc., which is all probably true. But you can't argue it doesn't work. It does. That's why it happens.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
In some cases it may have demoralized his opponents but in others it made them more emotional and not the calculating fighters they normally were. Jose Aldo for example is typically smarter then to surge forward the way he did against Conor. It maybe a little of both in that he takes pride in his work and think of himself as the best.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Awhile ago, Mike Tyson was quoted as saying he didn't want to fight again. He would remember he's special and his ego would takeover. I think it applies to the Conors and Muhammad Alis of the world. The talk and act the way they do knowing they're on a different level. Knowing they can back it up.

Its astonishing to me how many seem to not get this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,528 Posts
In some cases it may have demoralized his opponents but in others it made them more emotional and not the calculating fighters they normally were. Jose Aldo for example is typically smarter then to surge forward the way he did against Conor. It maybe a little of both in that he takes pride in his work and think of himself as the best.
Indeed. As i said, you can argue it shouldn't be like this, it shouldn't work, etc. But it does work.

To your point, was Conor better than Aldo? Absolutely. Would he have won had he acted like a gentleman in the buildup? No doubt. But did the trash talk have an effect and lead to a mistake and stunning world-record KO? Hard to deny.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
Well we won't know for sure what else would have happened in that fight because as mentioned, they fought once and Conor knocked him out in less then 10 seconds. Not to say that Conor didn't have trouble because clearly he did and only defeated Nate because he developed another strategy. But also he met his psychological match in Nate.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,528 Posts
Well we won't know for sure what else would have happened in that fight because as mentioned, they fought once and Conor knocked him out in less then 10 seconds. Not to say that Conor didn't have trouble because clearly he did and only defeated Nate because he developed another strategy. But also he met his psychological match in Nate.
Nate definitely psychologically strong. I don't think the trash talk had an effect, if anything the other way. Throwing that bottle was a bold move.

Gaethje's a beast. Interesting scuffle after the fight. Ferguson dialed it back pretty quick though. Two very respectful fighters.
 

·
The Title Guy
Joined
·
16,906 Posts
I think the problem was that Tony Ferguson was upset that it got stopped the way it did and that scuffle was emotions running high. As for Nate, yeah he has always gone in there intent on fighting partially with psychological warfare against his opponent. All the talking even during the fight is a way to get under his opponents skin.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top